Emotional Intelligence For The Everyday Man with Blase Grinner

Ian Hawkins 0:02

Are you ready, ready to release internal pain to find confidence, clarity and direction for your future, to live a life of meaning, fulfillment and contribution to trust your intuition again, but something's been holding you back, you've come to the right place. Welcome. I'm a Ian Hawkins, the host and founder of The Grief Code podcast. Together, let's heal your unresolved or unknown grief by unlocking your grief code. As you tune into each episode, you will receive insight into your own grief, how to eliminate it and what to do next. Before we start by one request. If any new insights or awareness land with you during this episode, please send me an email at info at the Ian Hawkins coaching.com. And let me know what you found. I know the power of this word, I love to hear the impact these conversations have. Okay, let's get into it.

You know a world where men tend to want to show how tough they are in other ways. Blaze greener is bringing emotional intelligence to the world in a way that even the toughest Man will understand. And this is a skill that he developed from quite a young age and some of the stories he tells you in leadership and and helping these grown men who have no nothing but really tough life and be able to show them that they can open up they can find a softer side they can speak up and let go of so much of the stuff that they're carrying so much of the pressure on the weight if you're a man who's experienced this or you are you no one that needs to give themselves some space and take some of the pressure off you're absolutely love this chat with Blaze. We get pretty deep when he talks about some of his experiences where yeah, let's just say traumatic experience where he saw the world through a completely different lens and there's so much value in that for for those that are at that point where they just need a different perspective. They need to release the pressure and you gotta really love this chat with place gonna live driver. Please greener how I made good

Speaker 2 2:30

made like I mentioned that even better saying that you're in a para jersey.

Ian Hawkins 2:34

Absolutely always good to connect with another pair of tragic. We've already had a laugh at our own expense before we hit record. So we might best move past that as quick as possible. So we were just talking before we came on, we've been connected on Facebook for a long time you feel like yes or no someone without actually knowing them. This is the first time we've actually connected. So it's great to chat. And you do a lot of awesome work in the space particularly with men much needed work. What was the inspiration to get into that space originally?

Speaker 2 3:11

Yes, so the I was in construction. So I was in I was the age of 24 became a foreman inside the civil inside construction in the civil industry. And so from a very young age, I was immersed in that macho bravado culture of men hiding like masking their emotions, their feelings and having a puff their chair stop pretending to be someone that they weren't just to try and fit in. Even like the apprenticeship culture, like the way that was like the, especially with the work I do around initiations like the being an apprentice under construction, it's like the worst form of initiation through shame and ridicule. And like yeah, so that was my biggest that and rugby league. I played high level rugby league. So both of those fed, they allowed me to see the lens of like, man, men need help. Though, within construction within rugby league, I lead everything and so I enjoyed leadership I Captain every rugby league team I played in aged 24 became a foreman. And I've also really enjoyed getting to know people like really genuinely given a fuck about people and their story. And so as a young foreman, because I gave a fuck about my team, like it was like, they're my family. They're my brothers. And there's a reason why I was so wanted that. That my team's always outperformed everyone they did, they excelled and everyone wanted to be part of the team. But the simple thing was because I actually cared about them. I knew what their children's names were their wives names were what asked them about their aspirations. And because of that men felt safe around me. So they also just glows everything that I've been with. So like added like always counseling and mentor and before actually knew that I was so like member telling me about money struggles, cheating on their wives, their relationship issues, that being an absentee father the for the separated families but every struggle that these and these men with double my age practices when it's it's really hitting me but like how much pain these men were in like, like they were deeply painful and list having someone that allowed them just to speak openly and freely was all that they needed.

Ian Hawkins 5:40

My only goosebumps all over as well, massively. So my coach last couple of years, not at the moment, but they worked in mining. And they were running the office and same sort of experience. She's the sort of person that builds trust really quickly, like yourself, and they were coming in. And she was just having a conversation with them about life. And then she found that they were coming in earlier, and then creating that safe space. And what a life changer for all of these men to be able to open up. But what's interesting is, and this is good for the business owners, particularly if you're in bigger business, is performance. And results went absolutely through the roof, was that your experience as well for your team

Speaker 2 6:28

months. And the there's about: 3000

Ian Hawkins 8:11

it's not more.

Speaker 2 8:13

Yeah, I bought that's that's how many people actually feel the survey. Yeah, right. So yeah, it's, it is, and that is through one industry. This is this, it's so much.

Ian Hawkins 8:26

I want to keep going on that track. But I just had something sort of come aware to me is that I already get the strong sense that you have the capacity to hold space for big groups of people, like for the listeners, because the vast majority, if not all the people that listen and have that same skill set, but perhaps don't fully understand it. How does that show up for you when you're carrying a lot of other people's baggage? And how do you actually navigate that in a way that allows you to keep doing the work that you do?

Speaker 2 8:59

Yeah, so this is something I had to learn. And I learned through adversity and burnout is I had to start to learn and understand the energy game. Because all this stuff like this trauma, and in these experiences, as people were confiding within me, I was allowing that their story to actually penetrate me, and I would empathize with them. And so I'd start carrying the weight of the world on my shoulders as well. So what I had to what I really had to do is care but not give a fuck. And that's good. And so I genuinely care but don't give a fuck about it and understand that like that's their journey. That's their karmic cycle that I can support and help and guide but like that's there and draw lines and have like really firm boundaries. Especially when I was new to coaching and everything is just like yeah, man hit me. And I was just like, constantly chatting, whereas now instead of Imagine parameters and especially with like, phones are amazing. They're the one of the most powerful tools that we've been gifted, though they're managing time and space really well. I've been said to my wife, I haven't been in the water surfing for four weeks. And this by this my solf cup filling thing, because of his film, like too much like too much stuff. So this morning, every Tuesday at 5am, let's go for surfs. This morning, my first surf film, my calf came back she's how are you? I'm like, Babe, I'm back. I can feel that zing back. Like I feel alive. Like I feel full. I don't feel like I'm depleted. So yeah, just navigating boundaries is a very, it was challenging at the start. But then, but once I was able to implement them, then I was able to protect my energy like that.

Ian Hawkins: 10:47

Yeah, and if you follow that, it's something really important for all people to realize men and women is that you need to find out what that recharge that renewal process is. Strangely, for me, I kept getting told from from people the same message. It's running in my ear, but I hate running. And the interesting thing is, since I've made a commitment to be running three times a week, I'm actually falling in love with that little bit, which is my wife has been around for a long time just laughs at me, you know? Who are you? It's because of, it's because of just what it gives, like what you described there, when you get on back, it's like, it's like, instantly just go, like shift out of whatever funk you're in, when you find whatever that is for you. So I appreciate your sharing that plays with that too. And

: 11:35

I with that thing, that is that soul cut feeling thing. I also feel that it needs to be something that just you doing it or being it is it so like even if the surf shit, just me getting out fills my cup. I mean, the salt water, it doesn't matter if I catch a wave or not like they are for now caught two waves. Couple, and I fell off once running. It's like whether it's rain, hail, sight, uphill, downhill, it doesn't matter as you move in your body. And so sometimes I see people having that anchor, something like the gym. It's like, awesome. But if it's attached to having to have a six pack and benching heavy and everything that it's still doing, and it's like, is it being or is it doing and I personally feel that that soul cut feeling needs to be something that is being and there's no, there's no goal, like it is about fun and feeling

Ian Hawkins: 12:33

and 100% Because so many men are stuck in competition. And so they make it a competitive thing within themselves. And of course, the comparison. And that's not the point, that was actually a big realization for me. So why Why can't I get back into running? And it was exactly that I was comparing my times to when I was running three, four years ago. Now. Even though they're playing football, like, I've never going to be back at that type. I'm getting close now mind you, but like, I just decided, What if I just ran. And I just actually did it for what it brings. And the other thing is literally just yesterday, I had this same thought around what you were talking about. People often exercise and they're not being there. They're either listening to music, or they're watching the video or even when they're walking the dog whatever, that they're not present. Surfing. Horses presence, right.

: 13:33

I love it, man. And then the other thing too is surfing is if you want to talk to me, you're gonna paddle out here.

Ian Hawkins: 13:39

Yeah, get on my level

: 13:42

of all disconnection, it's just me and spirit where it's literally in nature.

Ian Hawkins: 13:48

So if you're someone looking for that renewal, then it's important that it is a space that's just you and you, where you can allow your mind, which is always busy some time to actually do some processing.

: 14:00

A lot of the time too. It's usually something that we enjoyed as

Ian Hawkins: 14:03

a kid. Always.

: 14:07

Skateboarding, shooting hoops, playing Lego like Yeah, yeah,

Ian Hawkins: 14:12

it's good point. I never know where these chat together go. But this has been really good information for people. But what are you back to your story? So let's do that. I can tell just by the Goosebumps I got when you were talking about the impact that you were having for those men. And the fact that my whole throat is clearing around this important part of your story. What What was the inspiration for for being that leader for getting so much out of helping other men?

: 14:50

Yeah, there's been two two main catalysts is one was my father leaving at seven and so not having a father Like having an absentee father and then being raised by my stepdad. So I was always craving. Like, I can't, I can't remember. And I don't even think if it's happened that my dad's actually physically said, I love you. And the I can't remember a time. I've seen it in his eyes, but I've never heard the words that I'm proud of you. And I saw this reel the other day about fatherhood. And it really hit me. And it was about, I think, about a year ago or so. And it said that there's two gentleman talking about how long do you have left for the dad is like, 20 years? And he's like, it's not really 20 years, man, how often do you see him every year? And he's like, ah, like, because he has only 60. So if you live to 80, what 20 years is will how often you see him every year is like, Oh, well, once a year, he goes, Well, you've only got 20 times to see your dad again. Then I put that into perspective with my father as an online, my dad's in his 70s I see him once every two to three years. Back, I have five times left to see my dad. And I've tried to rekindle the relationship. And it's like, man, I've gone through heaps of psychotherapy and psychology and stuff with this of that. Just to accept him for him. And just like he is always going to be like that, because the man that I want him to be is me. I want him to be like me, which he does have that capacity. No matter how much I'm navigating and sharing my emotions when needs and reaching out. It is not happening. And it's like, it's yeah, it's really hard. It's, it's it. It is super challenging. And I think because of that from such a deep seated young age of how much I craved leadership, fatherhood, an elder, and looked at it for in so many wrong places. I literally became that man.

Ian Hawkins: 17:03

Yeah, right. Again, man, I thank you for sharing that. Because that's going to be a big one for many, for many. And for this one, specifically for men like so what you're facing now, and you've got that time I face that after my dad was already gone. And I started learning all this stuff. And I'm like, Well, what do I do now? I want to ask him things. I want to talk to him. And I want to be able to do all of that. So what you've just described there, yeah, no, you haven't got five years, 20 years, whatever you've got those those moments that you are creating space for. It's why I now regularly catch up and take my mum out to lunch because it's those moments that not just for you, but for them as well.

: 17:51

Hundreds that I've got three kids or two boys and a girl and the eldest boy just turned five. Exactly what you just said, is like, I want to ask him so much. I'm gonna ask Mike so much. He's forthright. I had my first conscious conversation with him at the age of 32. I'm 39 now and he disclosed a lot of information I asked a lot of questions brought up a lot of shit and he owned some stuff couldn't remember and stuff because he was drunk. But I asked him a lot about his childhood which I got to know my last name was changed by depot. So grin is not my last real last name. There's a lot of domestic violence that was very violent, managed alcoholic. And so when when I found out that my wife was fiancee at the time was actually was my fiance hadn't proposed it with my partner was pregnant with a boy as a boy was like, fuck it. I'm gonna be the man in my lineage to break this cycle. So I'm gonna change my last name. So I changed my last name by Depop. I and I told everyone in my life. The last person to irae was my dad to tell him, it was the it was the everyone, it was the most challenging one. But he acknowledged that he's like, Yeah, I can understand why you're doing that. Just to let you know, Tenzing isn't our last name either, like what tough but so this family secret came out there. So his mum. So he she remarried when he was two. And so Townsend was hit my dad's stepdads last name. So my brothers and sisters, our whole lot. He didn't even tell my mum that. And so my real last name, my real birth last day, in the lineage is Burke. And so I have a lot of Aboriginal mates with their last name book and have a deep affinity for indigenous culture. And is this like, well, but And so always the man in the lineage just because I've changed the last time that secret came out. But back to asking the questions. So for the listeners, we can't see but I've got three journals here to turn my son one of my daughter, so every Wednesday 8:30am. I started this about three months ago. I spent half an hour journaling and writing to one child, everyone Each year, man and I started thinking about like, I'm super conscious to talk as much as I can openly with my kids. But that regret is what you have. And I just wanted to know. And so I'm pouring my heart. And then, like how we speak and here is how I'm speaking to my kids. So yeah, like it's, I'm going to give them to each of them when they have their first bought. And so yeah, it's just something that I tell the so many people and it's one of these, these things too, about success. So the most successful people are willing to have long term gratification, like so it's like, they're willing to wait for the gratification. It's not the short term fixes. Like, that's something man that that's like, 2030 year project. It's cool.

Ian Hawkins: 20:49

There's a real eye opener for me, a few different things is like hearing all these wonderful things that we're talking about my dad at his funeral and, and realizing every funeral, I've been to his senses, like, if only they'd been to Haiti, to actually hear this. And then having conversations with my wife's grandparents about the war, and every day having to go into a bomb shelter. And like, like, this history, like we need to be parked on a better job actually interviewed my mom for the not for the podcast, but for the family's benefit, and digging to get more of that stuff somewhere. So that we've actually got records and what you're creating there, like, that's next level stuff. And wow, what a gift to be able to give them.

: 21:41

Pro it's so healing for me. Of course, it's like, because, like you, I've always wanted to write a book as well. And I've been talking to a couple of book right men that have written books and people read books, they're like, do just start and I have a commitment to write for one minute. Does that it, just write for one minute and even, I don't know what I'm going to write. So write that, hey, I don't know what I'm not gonna write. And then next thing, it just flows out. It's just, oh my god, I just own some shit. I'm gonna go clean my shit up. I remember like I had some was my daughter, man. I was like, my daughter's not even two. I was writing to my daughter. And within that my arm was, I was able to manipulate it with my mind so easily in the world around. But as soon as I wrote about this stuff, to pretend to this anger and resentment I was feeling with my mum, and my wife was copying the brunt of it. Sounds like that to my daughter and my dad be that fucking man. And so it was great from that journal. Hey, babe, I need some space. And when did this major rage exercise. But there's because I was journaling to my daughter. That's not gonna sit there for 2030 years, but I just could choose the catalyst of what I like, can't hide from that. So yeah, man, it's, it's beautiful. I'm enjoying it. And it's a chance to give them insight into everything about my nuances, like and so for me is like, I wanted to know what my dad's greatest fear was, what was his biggest challenges? How did he handle certain situations like, and so I'm trying to give them insight into that kind of stuff of like, how my inner workings my inner processes. So yeah.

Ian Hawkins: 23:30

Yeah. I want to come back to two you talked about was there's a fair bit we still want to unpack. Yeah. And I want to come back to you said your dad leaving at seven was was a massive thing. So for someone who's come to the point of acknowledging and acceptance around that, and then doing the work, what were the patterns that played out for you, through those teen years, young adult years, older years? And how did that negatively impact you?

: 24:08

Yes, so it was, as a young boy, I just crave to be led. I wanted a role model. And so I found that through that, I remember the first role model that ideally connected to was this gentleman by the name of David Morris is my under 11. And a top football coach is a really, really good man. He was a really solid man. And he was the first person other than my mom to call me Blasi. And he just knew how to, he'd get in my ear. And he takes me away from the team and he just like, did push me and drive me like a day aboard. And he just got so much out of me on the football field. And it was through his mental shift and at the age of 12 than my first trip to Paris. Remember how much I loved him. He invited us out for skiing and so I'd go family trips with him and we go go in that boat scan and stuff like that, it was just, it was amazing. He really brought me into his life. And it was really interesting too, because he had a son that was in, in our team as well. And, yeah, so. So that was that was the first eldership that I really crave towards. But then went into the different teams. But then so then started just always connect, always connected with my 40 coaches always eldership role, but then at the age of like 1415, I started getting really good at Rugby League. So I started playing eighth grade so that as a teenage boy just going through puberty around grown men, and some men that have gone through their heyday and so they didn't make it in the league. And so they read they started reliving their adolescence through me. And so the biggest mask was those two big masks the athletic master three, athletic, aggressive, and also sexual masks. So the more aggressive I was on the football field, the more I celebrated and so these were men would just pump me up like I was halfback pretty skinny do but if I take people out and and I just be cheered and revered, I thought, yeah, this is who you are. This is what it means to be managers. The most toughest man I can be on the footy field. Yeah, like I was so depressed, so insecure. Then the other thing I get on the tour bus and then back then my nickname was was sugar. And they're like, shook up the back of the bus and that just be asking me all these sexual stories. Who you fuck in a weekend? How was she happy? That's freezing me. And then it was just really toxic man. I remember. I watched I saw pornography for the first time. Like on an under 15. Free trip, or VHS? Oh, it's back in 15 Min. And a 40 code put that on a VHS while we were here. I'm watching porn with a whole group of men that were teenagers. Like no one. No, no good man. And it was all like, it was It wasn't nice porn either. Like, no porn, I feel might get out of rabbit hole but so that that sexual mask that was a big, like, really deep negative thing that happened because I objectified women. And then I remember just the CHE I cheated on my first girlfriend when I was like 14. And I remember the shame of like, I didn't get caught in the act. But her dad caught me at the back of one of the footy shirts, and I buried that shame for so long. And then for every girlfriend up until meeting my ex before my wife, so I was like 30 I cheated on them. Because I didn't realize but it was like that shame that I felt that I buried. I didn't want to have someone do that to me. So I just I'd have the one up and sales like I would one up every relationship. And so it was just it was so toxic that so then I became then I started like really getting rebellious around like 16 Seven, eight, and started to like, be that invincible mass. Like I'm the god's gift. I had a player manager for the footy club and RL club chasing meals on scholarship. And so I was like what those next funny stuff. And the then I started hanging around these, these dudes are out of school. And so they're in the early 20s Dealing heavy drugs. One of them went to jail. It was the biggest drug bust Queensland had had at the time, you know, 714 years. Another one of the men that I was used to hanging around. He's the one that shot a police officer turned the gun on himself down at Grantham. Are these the dudes I was knocked around when I was 16. And I was running drugs. And so like then I got into I remember I was high on speed at my formal through grade 12. And so got into that drug scene. But the thing was, it was it was so I remember the first meeting and went to this pub, I was underage. It was a lunch meeting and what they spoke about at this table, I'm like, Man, I see this in Mafia movies. I saw that this was fuck is so cool. I was like, I was in this thing, man. I'm going to be protected. I've got these elders and these dudes hanging around me. And literally when we get when we went to get up the leader, he's like, Do you know what the fuck happens if you speak at the school don't cool I'm gonna get shot. But that was cool. I was part I belonged. I had this thing and they they and because I was the youngest of everyone. They you were like always, like their little brother though is like having a big brother that was like no doesn't look after me through everything. Like someone would give me shit. They would go sorted out and it's so yeah, because of that at the age of 18. Either three years of age 18 or three years has been a jail sentence. Just heard a team and yeah, so we had a grievous bodily harm company grievous bodily harm charged in company. And our stick at it was, it wasn't in my fight then I just came in as my cousin was getting a hiding and I stuck up for him. And then because I didn't roll my cousin they threw the book at me. And so I was about to serve jail for three years because I wouldn't roll the handle this footage and everything. Because I was like, That stoic wouldn't give my mela and I just remember laying in bed man. So scared, because I went to I went to court and the judge said to me, he's like, where's your legal representation? Young man? I'm here with the duty so say you're about to go to jail. I'm going to adjourn for you go get a barrister as it's like what the fuck? And somewhat at the age of 20 at age 1820 $20,000 personal loan to pay for my lawyer so then money story. Yeah, so I was suspended so nicely serve time. But I didn't realize how bad that was also had three DUIs within, in between seven and eight as well. Like drunk driving charges. I was just that close man to not being here. Of like, like I've always wanted to pass the destruction of like, the lucky that only the like I could have killed people drink drive. And you mean like all these like, fights I was in like, man, there's people dying with it. But yeah, I was so fortunate. so fortunate.

Ian Hawkins: 31:32

Yeah. Like many mentors, your mind boggle about what could have gone so much worse. Like, imagine three years in prison would have been like what you imagined you'd had an accident.

: 31:46

The CIO at the time, it was like, I had that mentality that life was happening to me. I was just getting fucked by life. I got molested when I was nine. Like fuck, why is this happening to me? I was just so so angry man. But now it with hindsight is a beautiful thing, that I'm so relatable to every man. So know that my why I had such a colorful upbringing and childhood and adolescence and early teenage years and early adulthood. Is I'm so relatable to everyone. And I know now I know, this is why I'm here to do this. And so it's like I don't live too far in that what if could have happened? But I will say but because I sometimes I do to use it as a motivator. So there was someone close to me that attempted suicide, and was a minute away from bleeding that he slipped both his wrist that's 26 stitches in 60 seconds away from from dying, but he survived. And he blamed me for moving away and because I've left my childhood town and moved to the Sunshine Coast because their child surgeons, and I clean my act I've got a job with the AR Australian Rugby League and yeah, it was started the new blades the new thing New Year, I stopped playing league as well. I stopped playing footy. But that that scenario of him attempting suicide that set me wait. Like it just yeah, for five years got addicted to everything. gambling, prostitution, steroids, anything that to make me feel good for that short term gratification. Like gambling man, like I wasn't a big salary construction. I just put it on the pokies and not offseason. Cookies and all that kind of stuff. So yeah, man.

Ian Hawkins: 33:40

For the listeners benefit, I was having this conversation about someone the other day that I know well. And it's the rash, right? Like there's the rest of our life when numbing everything. So all of those pieces actually provide something that we just can't access in other parts of life. So tell us a little bit about about that sort of experience for you. And now how you now have taken that knowledge to be able to help people find more of that in their day to day.

: 34:13

Yeah. So the there was, there's the right aspect. But there's also another aspect of I didn't seek, I didn't talk to anyone until I was 31. So like, I had so much buried emotions and everything that I'm disclosing to you I hadn't spoken anyone about because it was like if you did that you're broken. Like and so always my just seeking the rush. I just wanted to fucking numb man. I just wanted to numb the pain that I was feeling and that because I didn't have the emotional intelligence to be with anything. So that's why I was using the escape. And so that that was a that was I know much about the rush as well. And I'd love to talk about that because the rush aspect fade something, which is an identity that led to my spiritual awakening. But there was like the rush side of things, but also there's a lot of grief there that I hadn't hadn't dealt with. And so seeing where they're coming from the addiction is like, is it the rush? Or is it? Is it the numbing? Or is it a combination of both?

Ian Hawkins: 35:23

I'll explain a lot of this from my experience. So so what I was numbing was the emotional side of things because I was highly sensitive and sensory, so overloaded. So I just learned to push that shit down. And I would be drawn to moments where that was, okay. So to feel something funerals, like that used to puzzle me, and, you know, imagine as a teenager, like, why am I so attracted to this, like, sort of space? And I'm, like, why is this something so sad feeling so good? Was because everywhere else in my life, I wasn't allowing myself to feel anymore. And if you look at, like, the work we do with men, is that they've blocked off so much of this stuff. The rush is to feel something.

: 36:08

Yeah, so I was the opposite man is, so I was super, like, I was able to access emotions. I didn't have a problem crying in front of people. I didn't have a problem being angry in front of people. It was just I was actually the other spectrum versus like, it was almost too much. It was like, whatever emotion I felt, I just fucking fully expressed that. So for me, it was about play. So because dad left when I seven mum said something to me, which fucked me up. She said, you're now the man that house and I took literal, I took this rule. And so I literally was, I had, I'm the eldest of five, mum, who grew up in housing commission. So Mum was working two, three jobs just to feed us, she would go without food, like we live pretty poor. Financially, abundantly, there's a lot of love that she gave us, but financially poor. But I was getting kids up making their breakfast getting up for school on a uniform, so I literally lost the childhood. So for me with drugs, the parties and everything, it was actually that just playing there, just fucking enjoy myself. But because I didn't have that as a kid. I was always so rigid with football, it was football. And because I played three games a week, trying six times a week, obviously, an outlet. So it's all a football, it was sport, academics, and then looking after the kids raising the kids. And so just didn't have that play. That's their place. I could just fucking let go. And so that letting go, it would feel so good when I did it. Oh, what does it feel like to have more of that? So go from having one hooker, I'm gonna have two hookers. Rather than these two workers, I want to hook her that looks like a mom and a daughter. But taking it to the what? How can I keep upping it up in that? And this is how the spiritual awakening happened. So with all of that, you

Ian Hawkins: 38:06

know, can we just pause and ignite because you've pointed out something that for anyone who's been high level at anything, and we look at these athletes now and we and we hold them to such high regard and an expectation, but this is the experience for so many of them, right? And so always like they miss out on so much. And often people just saying yes to them constantly. And then we expect them to suddenly flick a switch because they're in the public eye.

: 38:38

Like and also validating. Validating the their sense of worth for themself validating them in such unhealthy manners. Yeah, aggression on the football flight, I'll just use my love the aggression celebrating that. So the harder I went, the more and then the better I got at football. The more accolades I got, the more teams and premierships all that kind of stuff was more celebrated. So leading to these false sense of freedom and purpose that are so fucking hollow, because when they go, identity crisis, so my first identity crisis, it's 18, because I realized that my dad was glory hunting, because he came back into my life when I was 12 when I made my first rep team, and he was super present there, so I love that dad's back, and he was a photographer. And so he'd be taking photos. She's super active in my life. But then when all the court stuff happened, I just had this intuition and I really want to thank my mom for like not she knew what was going on. And but when I said I remember like, Well fuck it. I'm gonna see what happens if I stopped playing football. I then first start playing football with my dad taught me then taught me for you. And then my mom, I remember her saying, I wanted you to find out for yourself because I didn't want to give you the fuel, but he was his glory. How's it like inside gave up the my love of my life? The fucking thing that gave me so much purpose because of Yeah, like there was the drug scene and then with that, and then so I had that there was a big identity crisis like who the fuck am I? I was the next free star. I even went so far down the rabbit hole that I hated as a kid going the footy games and you come home with a signature on the football and I didn't know who the fuck it was because I was just scribble. So I ensured that my name my signature was legible. So all the kids knew who the fuck I was. And I was always that always there. But JT and I went to school together. Him and I were best mates. We played a great together when he was I remember I was there when Ken Erie come to for his trials. There's 26 men that I went by played with I captain that played NRL. Like so many people that made it and I was just like, Yeah, so like Travis burns the low boys, low brothers. JT with Manny, Manny Balan, all these dudes man. So many like I was right there.

Ian Hawkins: 41:12

We might come back to that because there's a bit to unpack. But what you said there I think really important for the parents listening because there's a that's that's kind of where this audience sits and asking yourself, are you glory hunting for your children? And are you how you showing up at will their life around what they what you want for them, but is it what they want for them?

: 41:40

Prior to that breaking up with your parents? I think everyone needs to do that at some stage like climbing back your manhood and becoming a father. I remember changing my boys nappy, and I went down a rabbit hole. I remember my partner and I went, we were in it with our second child. We got some relationship counseling. And I remember changing my little boys nappy, thinking this could be another man right now. And then looking at my boy like if if I don't commit to fucking saw that shit out. It's gonna be another man doing this. And then I had this epiphany, our man, why are you feeling jealous? You think you own this kid? He's not yours. One day is gonna fucking break up with you. I was just like, oh my god, man. Like, in we're surfing. I so want my kids to surf. I've seen surf trips that I just take my kids on. And I've noticed how hard I was pushing my oldest boy to surf, like, set the fuck back? Is that what he wants? He might want to be a ballerina, like, open up everything that's possible to him. I could really see I was instilling like my stuff on him. And so it's a huge thing is like the Jews were?

Ian Hawkins: 42:48

Well, I've learned that the hard way. From having my I think she was 15 My oldest say, What makes you think this has got anything to do with you, dad. And then and then the same thing. So more young fella playing high level football for three years. And both his parents being gathered when he decides to step away. But he's so much happier. And what you said about play? It's what do you sign his alma mater all hanging out together? And I'm training three nights a week and then pretty much all day, Saturday they're off doing stuff won't be doing that. And yeah, like it was pushing this was this him or me and, and it's like, the sooner you can learn that. Like, it's not just the freedom, it gives you a child, it's a freedom it gives yourself because then you can turn your attention from trying to get them to do all the things you missed out on and actually live your own life and, and do the things that you missed out on. Because you can still do them in a different way. But you can still do

: 43:55

that. That's that's where I see a lot of parents that are the glory heightened because they've lost purpose within their own life. Yeah. And they start to relive it through their childhood. And so that invitation for the listeners is if you catch that, what's your purpose? Come back to that? Find it. Find that no reason

Ian Hawkins: 44:13

to exist? Yeah, no, that's been for you. Like, so what what some? You say find that, but what some advice you can give them when they are at that point. Like where would they look

: 44:27

inwards inward first. So that's going to be the inner compass that in words, because a lot of time for these and is going to generalize this and this is for the end these generalizations are coming from the men that are in my vortex which are fathers that have teenage sons and daughters. And so they're usually in their 40s or 50s. They've gone through a position in their life that the tried a few things, but then they've just settled and they've just succumb to like this is my life now. It's I go to work, come home. It's all about the kids and So they've lost their reason to exist, they've lost this motivation. They drive what I call their mojo. And so my invitation for those men is to look into like, like, go like, in 10 years from now where you want to be, do you still want to be here? Are you still have like life in you? Like, it doesn't have to be like changing the world. But what do you want to do? What do you want to achieve? If you don't know that go explore, try, like give it 30 days, what ever is give it 30 days and give it 100%. So if it's, if it's if it's dancing, go fucking dance every week, man and give it 100% and pay for that, just so that you can know, hey, that's not for me.

Ian Hawkins: 45:40

That 30 days is so critical. Yeah, because too often people go, This isn't working. And it's like, you don't want something magical happens at one month, where suddenly it's whether it's a level of competency, or you notice improvements, or whatever it is. Often that's the time where some form of self sabotage shows up as well, and injury and illness or distraction, whatever. If you can move past that one month at 30 days. Like that's when yeah, sometimes Sure. This is not the right thing. But too many people give up at that point, or before that point, and they never get to find out if it was actually a thing.

: 46:17

Yeah. And yeah, always start there. And the other thing is the to look into how they want to feel, because it's not the thing that we desire. It's how that thing makes us feel that we actually desire. So these men, I'm just going to use them as an example. And so these men that hit these Groundhog Day, but this loop just like everything's just like mediocre, or life is just rinse repeat. They they've lost their sense of freedom, purpose, motivation, drive, all that they've lost all these feelings, because they're in the mundane, they're literally in autopilot. So then finding how do you want to feel that you don't even know what it is that you? How do you want to feel? And like finally, like, what is it that you how do you want to feel? And doing that? First I had, what do you want to feel you want to feel confident, strong, courageous, and a jet, whatever it is abundant, then go find stuff to do. And then that's your inner compass. That's why saying go inwards first is fine. If you find that then cool. Kick out. If you don't find that try something else. This is where people went COVID happened, right? So many people, I don't feel free anymore. Because the government locked you down. Like, so you're you're getting dictated by the external environment. And I've got a one of my highest one of my values is adventure. And so adventure is an unusual, daring experience. And so I love the outdoors. All their kids names are the elements of life love in the 34 countries between us. So COVID happened, can't go anywhere. Okay, cool. I could succumb to that. Or I could tap into my values. Okay, one of my values is adventure. How does adventure feel to me, exploring, it's unusual, is daring. Men were pitching tents in the backyard making cubby forts like you put the adventure into the house like it like so I could still have that same feeling. I still have that same feeling that being camping does in my own house, but I was dictating it. Awesome. So from that inner

Ian Hawkins: 48:36

I'm going to introduce you to a mate of mine who does a podcast of adventure, which I think you'll be a great fit for as well. Mate, you shared some awesome stuff there just around that. That whole purpose space. And the how you feel is a big one. Because even the bad shit that we do, and that people do is because of the belief that they'll feel better from doing it. So you think about even those guys you hung out with of the ordinary things that they were doing. It was still it was giving them something or they would believe that it would give them something. Yeah. Yep. The other thing around purpose that I've learned is that and this will, I think you'll relate to this a lot is that when we find something that helps other people get what we didn't get, then that's when it just gives us the absolute bargain if you think about exactly what you've described your upbringing, searching for that leadership, and now you're helping other men to find that later in life. As you have like, Man, what a gift.

: 49:42

Yeah, man. It's so rewarding. It's the at. It's so rewarding. And it was also detrimental because I actually had another identity crisis when my daughter was born, so she's almost two. And so I built this His men's movement here on the Sunshine was a global men's movement. But the chapter on the Sunshine Coast had 500 local men and we're doing meetups every every week, Tuesday morning off Moffat Beach meetups every week. And it grew that there was like 3040 Men's meetups. And I start seeing a psychologist wanted to go clinically into the emotion of anger, and research myself and my past. And I was starting to burnout. And he did this process. And I'd love to give this listeners this. He said, What do you got going on? I said, Look, at the month of June, we've got blows venture, I've got my three kids, I've got my wife. I've got the retreats that I'm running against LA to do this stuff and put everything on the table. He's like, fuck, dude, you have so much going on? And like, yeah, man, it's like, I think that's why I'm here. It's a cool process. And like, Yeah, and he's like, now and why I was seeing him was like this frustration and resentment was coming through those projective and my wife and just not dealing with my emotions, I wanted to clean that up as like, cool. I'm gonna throw your life up in the air. And I'm going to do it now. ADB energy went like this on the ready. I know what the kids is, like, grab no one, but work. And he's like, is that cool? And I just wrote man just bawled my eyes out. As it's like, What the fuck, I chose my kids and work where the fuck is my wife there. That's why I'm here. And that was my permission slip of my crew, I need to let go of this, this thing that I built, I need to let it go. And so I did to like FCMB, like other chapter was present for the pregnancy and just couldn't put a complete different shipping. And this is a baby that built for years blood, sweat, tears and like, but the thing that it was doing, was this feel good. was also it was every day, man. So people patting me on the back getting text messages from wives and children and community and so many people celebrating what I was doing that I forgot to do it for myself. So that when I stepped away from CMB, I went through this thing of like, I'm not doing enough for humanity. I'm not helping enough people. The thing was, it was feeding the ego was feeding this identity, blaze the facilitator. And so I created this thing that I wasn't worthy unless I was facilitating, but it was the biggest, beautiful this lesson within my business. Because now it's what it's having a conversation face to face with someone's wife about how connected they are, again, that no one is ever going to see that it's not on social media. Or when I got COVID on my three retreats ago, and so I had to step back. I couldn't do any facilitation. There's a big group photo. So I've got 34 Men, 10 facilitators, videographer, they'll take a photo, not fucking one of them turn around and look for me. Not one. I was standing watching. As and this was the beautiful moment it was his this was the aha moment my big awakening is like, oh, man, I can have this sense of fulfillment and pride in here. And no one other than me and spirit of me and God of witnessing this. I just remembered weeping in this joy and gratitude. Like look at that. It does its thing and it doesn't need me to work. How rewarding is that? And so that has been a really beautiful thing. So it's yes to that, that the purpose, but just remember if it goes, if that thing stops, are you still going to be content with yourself? Are you still going to feel fulfilled? Are you still gonna feel pride? That's the that was that double edged sword.

Ian Hawkins: 53:45

Yeah. 100%. And I think that I was really conscious through that was being able to do that without the validation that that earlier had been so important.

: 53:56

Yes. 100% Yeah, that's good, man. Don't move. Don't move does you're amazing.

Ian Hawkins: 54:03

Like it, but it's to be able to get to that point where you don't need it.

Unknown Speaker: 54:06

Yes. 100%.

Ian Hawkins: 54:12

Oh, the other thing I was conscious of, it's all the things get thrown up in the air. You grab your kids and work. And the bit that you realize you didn't grab with your wife, but in my head, knowing my journey. What about grabbing yourself? Yeah, man. And that's a that's a similar process, a lot of throwing it up in the air, but I get people to put it in order. And I let people know their own journey. But there's one thing that I kind of strongly suggest is when we talk about what's the priorities in your life. Yes, your kids are important. Yes, your partner is important. Yes, works important. But if you're not having yourself at the top of that list, then how on earth are you possibly going to be able to be the best parent partner business So no work colleague, whatever it is,

: 55:03

yeah, man, I, I learned those two lessons that they're saying listen twice super powerfully. So really quickly did a personal development with my partner at the time. And there was eight people in the room. And then your God given sticks and the white people and you had to go round and you had to give it with there's a spaceship, there's 1212 space on the spaceship to go. Everyone had to get give your sticks out. The people with the most stick their seat onto the spaceship. At the end of the process. I had the most sticks cool. Melinda was there and there's 12 of us on this spaceship fucking dramatic using everything like oh, hey, wait a second. You step back and get off the ship if you didn't give yourself a stick. Only motherfucker that didn't give myself a fucking stick. And the and the thing was beforehand, they gave us like an hour. Everyone had to had to pitch and sounds like fifth fifth us in rooms like fuck it. I'm out. I've had a good life. The other 40% were like trying to enroll each other like the haywire should be in there. And I've had a good life man life I've done so much cool shit sat down and actually not fuck it. So I got that was like, actually, there's one thing that I haven't done, like, yes, all this humanity stuff is everything. But I'm choosing to get on the ship for me because I'm I know. I know that I'm destined to be a dad. And I want to experience fatherhood. And so I'm going to come back for me. And like, literally, I was talking about I'm coming back for me to be a father. And when this dramatic music couple of I visualize the ship going off, and I'm just like, fuck, if I don't choose me, how the fuck am I even going to be a father. And so it was just this massive moment, man in my life like, life changing moment that I had to change, I had to choose myself. The next thing is where you got into real and so we've had to cater to boys. And we got deeply in it around some belief stuff with my fiancee at the time. And so we I started going into the exploiting plant medicine, and she's never done a drug in her life. never smoked a cigarette never had joint superclean I've been super down the other way that she's seen me I've relapsed and smoked i Seven years ago, and I just met her and so she saw me like blow myself. And that's when I first went and spoke to someone so she seen me at my worst. So she's got that version of me. And then to Bucha and bullies coming from one of my mentors. He's He's a native Native American man runs, sweats everything and parish ceremonies. His mentor, who is like, was came to Australian shores as it's like men, my mentors mentor can come and I can sit and do party like I have to be there for that. And she gave me an automatic if you go we're over as he slept blocked off. And it was like Wolf, as like, this is so important to me. So it was three days out, I went and sat in meditation when standard lightspace went to the Moffat Beach, I was just meditating, and I ran through my value system. And my values have been met and went down the rabbit hole. What happens if I do this? And we separate as like flat? What I tell my boys and this is the handle make bucking? How do I make this life changing altering decision, as I'm the only person that can judge myself, I'm gonna make it from my values and alignment with my values. I went through all of my values. Number one value is love, which is God or connection to spirit. And so with that, and it's my my partner's phrase that I have adopted. Love is Love is the answer. And love will always find a way somewhat well if this is true love, it will find a way. Fuck. Bro, my network, my next value is trust. And it's not trust of other people who is trusting in the divine path. I was like, What the fuck? And then I went through the pecking order of like, okay, and then spirituality is part of my value system. And then I went through the order of how I was choosing everything. And so I was like, okay, so goes Melinda, the kids, men's work. Where the fuck is where am I on that list? Where's my spirituality on that list? Holy, If faith is so important to me, and if I can't choose my faith and myself over everything, I'm a shell of a man. So I'm like, Cool, I'm gonna go do this peyote ceremony. And I was super clean with it. Because if when my boys gonna vote why, why did we split up because they start to lose values and everything I just said that I would explain to them. So I'm always good with that. So well and it was the most profound experience in my life. They call peyote shimmering heart. That's the translation. And they did this song, that the song that all the children on the planet know that they are loved, and they just keep singing this song. And it's like that's what I believe. And I just remember weeping and we up for hours meant that I'd found this love in this connection and wasn't outside of myself. It was in my heart. And these people have been praying to this same prayer for eons. So yeah, like, then I came home. And I actually when I came home, it was like two or three days later, so I was gone for about five days, all my shit man was at the back, it was we're over. But I'd had such a profound experience, I came home super grounded. So hey, I love you more than anything. I'm here to raise our kids together. But this is the terms that I want to agree to. I want to pray from now on, I want to thank our food, and I want to live a life of gratitude. Gratitude is one of our highest values as well. I want to be thankful for our life. And I want the kids to know that each animal doesn't come from Woolworths that is our life, there was a beam that was killed so we can be nourished that we live in abundance of everything, I pray to the water before I serve. And I completely have chosen faith and my belief and ritual ceremony that way of life, and enroll my wife to do the same. And so now, we've got another we've got a daughter now, we pray. We don't say Amen. We actually say our home, which is a men's work phrase. But my five year old Hey, buddy, what you got to say thank you for. And the one thing that I want to tell my dad face to face is I just wanted to say thank you for my life. Because you could have pulled out bro, you could have pulled out you didn't end because you didn't pull that you're gifted me this life. Now I just want to say thank you for Bama hat for that. And once that face to face, and this or that was my big thing I just wanted a face to face, you just wouldn't see me. My, my he was four at the time. Breath. My eldest boy turned to me. And I was going through all this with my dad, he turned to me and I'd never said this to him. I'd send it a version of it. But he tells me he's like, Daddy, thank you for my life. It's fucking for Doom. And he said that prayer didn't burst into tears. And we always say thank you for our life that we've been given. Thank you for this body. Thank you for all the bones coming away. But we've never directly like he did that man. So yeah, that is, but you're coming back to like, like values and like choosing myself. Big soul sabbatical moments where, like, massive, massive, like, Holy fuck, I'm about to walk away from my fiance and two children. Because I'm like, hadn't chosen myself What the fuck?

Ian Hawkins: 1:02:27

So good, that the importance of values? Yeah.

Who that's the greatest gift, when we do work on self is the impact it has for every person that we touch. But if you think of yourself as a parent, not you but the listeners. Why would you not want the best for your children. And if if you need anything to tip you over the edge to start this journey, it's that because when you change, they change. When when your children are going through tough stuff. Most people will rush to go I'm gonna get the best help. The best hope is you start with getting help for you. Because my children have been through their fair share of big stuff. And without that's one of those things like you know, you don't live with regrets, but they're like, I don't know if I call it regret but there's been some moments where I missed big stuff. Because I didn't know what I know now. And thankfully, they're both still here. But what what if that hadn't been the case? Like and so what you've shared they're just like, if you're listening and you're like well I don't know I can't do all of those things that seems way beyond me. That's not like blazers, journeys, Blazers journey, you've got to go on your journey of whatever that is that you need to be able to come be able to overcome so that you can be able to share that gift with the people in your world so much Blaze thanks. Love that you share that

: 1:04:06

thank you and unofficial something else around this grandfatherhood working like choosing so Kerwin Ray business mentor did some coaching with him and he put this video fuck struck this big chord with him because I love what I do with work. Like I love it. I get a lot of enjoyment out of it. And he said would you rather your children remember Eunice as a as a as a father that was always on time for work? Or would you rather than to remember the that your father chose them? And that what he was talking about is your specialty, I'll work from home and the kids are going to kindy and they're like, Daddy, I want to ride the bike. As I know no need to get worked out. It's like fuck, dude, you've worked for yourself. Like, go ride that fucking bike with your boy. And so I started doing that and the level of enjoyment and gratitude that he would have and that that Three, five minutes of presence for me being five minutes late and moving my fucking schedule for him, changed the game for me. And it happened this morning, man. So I sent you a message. Hey, bro, gotta be five minutes late coaching calls going over, because this is that thing. I've got home from a surf. I had 20 minutes before my coaching program and my eldest boys are Daddy, can we put that rocket up in the air is this water rocket you put half fill it with water, put air compressor and it fucking shoots like 30 meters in there. And last night, it was too windy. And I said no man, I can't last I don't want to go to someone's roof. And he's like, Dad, there's no wind. And like, I just like I caught myself saying I need to. And that was the Linguistics of I don't need to do fucking anything, buddy. Let's hook it up. So extension cords, compress that out the front. And I'm like, buddy, I've only got 10 minutes. I've got to set a timer so I can come on this thing. So yeah, man, we shot some rockets and he got wet. It was awesome it and it put me like I'm big about time being on time. So I was late for the first call with my team. That was the and they said you message and clean up my stuff. But every time I was like, This is what I was doing. I value your time, immensely. But that's why I was like, and so yeah, Kerwin taught me that by then just that eight minutes I had with him. He's gonna remember how we felt not what we did, but that I chose him.

Ian Hawkins: 1:06:27

So good. So good. Bad. My daughter. She's nearly 19 now and she talks about whenever i Jingle my keys in a certain way, it gives her a horrible flashback to after school care, because she'd be listening out we were always one of the last to pick him up is actually a big reason why we made so many changes, right as kids in the worst of us worse than that they're not getting us flogging ourselves working crazy hours and, and but you can change

: 1:07:02

100% I was so fortunate man, one of my husband 19 to 23 When my foreman when I first started in construction, he's like mate, and he was old school super heavy alcoholic. And he we both fit into each other's addiction. So he'd always have a three pack of gold powers gold in his car. And he's like, I might jump in and we do the rounds. And then so we do all the rounds, make sure everything's good, go at his particular pace, and then jump me back and pay me for full day, even overtime and everything. So he just needed a drinking buddy. It's like that whole eldership thing. But one of the things even though that was so negative, he used to say to me made my daughter's 21 I don't even know, this is just a fucking job. Make sure you don't dedicate your life to this and be a fucking drunk like me. And it just run with me run with me wrong with me. And then it got to the point that I was like doing. I was building a shopping center at Red backplanes. And I drive from the Sunshine Coast to there two and a half hours forward to a 12 hour day two and a half back for like months. As you got to that breaking point. I remember hitting the steering wheel this, but there's got to be more this back in life. I was just being short. Fight this and like, I wanted to be a dad. I wanted to try for fatherhood but obviously exhausted. And the kid did that. And I was just like, that was that man like, there's got to be a different way. I remember Ivan his name, was it. I think it's Ivan Skinner. Hitting is like, it's just the fucking job. You don't need the money like and then I was like, Cool. Well, what do I do? What do I want? What kind of life do I want? So I started designing that life before we had children, which was like, okay, cool. Construction is not going to be the lifestyle that I want. It works for people. And it's amazing. It's a beautiful way to earn a living, but just what didn't work from it.

Ian Hawkins: 1:08:54

And I love we've got that beautiful noise from the kids in the background as well. That's cool. Hey, you're a bit more time. Yeah. I just want to touch on two things. There's so much to that I couldn't go but I really want to just focus on two main areas if that's okay. So you mentioned the close the person close to you the suicide attempt, can you share a little bit about like, how that impacted you? What that was like from your perspective, and like how that unraveled things for you in the aftermath.

: 1:09:32

So it was maybe 130 In the morning, I was in a nightclub. And this person walked in to the nightclub. And I was like partying, on drugs, everything like that. A member saying, Hey, your friend has attempted suicide. I don't know. said their name has just killed themself. And I remember Drop. I was drinking JD JD and coconut rock like I remember that drop dropping the rock glass and watching it. No music not and just watching it in super slow motion smash over the ground. And then it's like what the fuck? And so yet ran back home and I was pissed so I've got my partner time to drive and my friend came with me drove from the Sunshine Coast at Toowoomba. So I drove. I drove. So I've got to the base of Toowoomba, and I'm trying to in the hospital is he alive? This please tell me if he's alive. And then we can't disclose that information because it's got to the bottom of the range and my whole body shut down. I couldn't drive out in this convulsion like this, this shock, get to a house and his mum got home and said you got to be you got to be tough, you got to be strong for for him, he's okay. But you've got to be strong. I remember it because he was at a party. And so he come home, it was like really early in the morning and had all these bandages on him, but he wanted a shower. So I had to put plastic bags on his arms and duct tape them. And I remember the emotion coming up of how how much pain and sorrow and grief I had with that. I pushed that fucking down and like, pushed it and pushed it and pushed it. And then when he went to bed or went at the back of that house, it just bawled my eyes out on my own in the fucking dark. And like, like taboo, and so yeah, that under the motion just that was just horrendous and so that that set me on that why would that why would the came back to the coast. And yeah, just I'm I hadn't hadn't used my fists hadn't gotten off fight for since I moved to this coast wasn't too long after that I got in a fight and really hurt someone again. And so yeah, just didn't know how to deal with any, any of that man. The. And so I didn't tell anyone either. I didn't tell anyone, hey, I'm just going through this, like someone close to me tried to kill themself. A lot of work, it was really affected me. And at the time was managing a nightclub. So I was like 2022 years old men's in a nightclub. And so I had free drugs free alcohol and the harlot that I partied, the more Limelight I chased, the more the party went off. And so I was like fuck, I was gonna keep having these big parties and forget about this pay. And that was went on for years.

Ian Hawkins: 1:12:53

So is that what ultimately led to to the moment of OD and then and then awakening to a different way?

: 1:13:02

Yes. So within construction that had this was a company or, or charity called NYC mating construction was a suicide prevention company. And so I didn't suicide. Australian was like 24 didn't have the emotional intelligence didn't tell them about the thing that happened two years ago. So I became a connector so green sticker, my hard hat maker come to me seek counsel and I'll put them onto a counselor. So that the limelight chasing was first I tried to ask it was this festival and I was had this amazing time. It was like beautiful euphoric feeling. And I had all of these fake people around chicks with fake tits, fake hair, fake everything. Dudes, like was on steroids. Like it was just all this fake stuff. And I just remember having an amazing time. And like, I want to have this again. So all these people that I met, ask them to come to my house the next week, got a DJ and in my house and took double of everything I had for that festival. So I had two tabs of acid. I snorted two pills, and then had something else as we drove to this nightclub in the Met in Brisbane. tore into the VIP thing I remember standing on this rail music's playing I think Calvin Harris is there somewhat someone big was there I remember just looking at all these lights and everything we had like a bottle service. I remember thinking myself I've made it but this is it. I was at the fucking peak of everything. And then all the GI hit. And I was just and it was it lasted for three days. And I could see entities that are attached to people like fucking Gremlins man, like the horror show that they were to test everyone. So and yet the CIO walked outside this like trick WHAT THE FUCK remembers is homeless dudes. I had a chat to him as most conscious conversation ever had. And I pissed myself. And because I pissed myself was at the front this like routine nightclub, they asked me to move on, I wouldn't move on. And they they tried to they write this I'm gonna ring the police in between the time that the police the pet first party wagon turned up and this conversation with this major the I had this realization that I was got as I'm gone. And I walked into the middle of valid fortitude Valley and I put my hands up and all the cars stopped. And I've walked out into the middle of four lanes and there's all the reality was sparkly and everything. And then they were moving like fucking Super stoma. And then I walked all the way back, and then continued a conversation with a homeless dude and went like that with my hand and all the traffic started. So I'm not sure it's like that, if I actually bet time and space, or it was, but I remember physically doing that. No, it wasn't I hallucinate or physically doing that. So whether it was a super fast vision or something, anyway said that policeman turned up and one button got, there's four policemen and I cleaned all four people up on their call for reinforcements that took nine police officers to put me in a paddy wagon. And then they put me into a padded cell. So lock me in a padded cell and back at this I was 27. So ISIS was like going nuts through social media and everything. And all that dark black shit, like real heavy stuff. Like I remember a friend that was part of that, like mafia crew. So the thing was, they had this black, there was a DVD, it was in a black case, they had no name and it was black. And as all people getting killed, like I used to watch that shit, man, it's so dark. So get in this padded cell. And because I'd heard all these police officers that are super fucking rough with me, and they pin me one of them pin me down and put his his foot on my head. And as they were like processing me on this independent cell phone in my head, I can hear these people like these like screams because I put all people coming off heroin and stuff in there. And so I can hear these people screaming and I had a hallucination that they're killing my sister and my sister that my mom's getting murdered, that they're killing my dad. I thought that these guys were ISIS and because I was God and now our demons are trying to fucking kill me because I was like, anyway, yeah, so I got to this point that that my head was down and they're about to slice my head off and decapitated within a vision. And I'm like, I just had this flashlight I've had a good life I've had an amazing life and so I was just like, I don't have anything else to live for. They've killed all my family fuck it, I let go. And so when I let go, I wake up in this room reality and there's like people I could see people really clear really vivid from like their head to like they're just below their torso below their groin area, but they didn't have legs. And there was like hundreds of people man like hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of people that are new. And then so so what's what's going on? Like Where the fuck are we and then next thing I wake up and I'm sitting in the middle of the padded cell in full lotus and I've never meditated before and so some of what the fuck was that? And so end up going to the pet itself and there's a long journey I went on for like two days I won't go into that it was like fucking horrendous being like just I was like, I drove I can cut my work you off the Warrego highway 120 kilometers. And I thought that I could like fucking chase a cloud man. And how it didn't hit a fucking fence or a tree like nuts like how it didn't die. But after I started coming to I was I was

Ian Hawkins: 1:19:03

sorry, so they just released you.

: 1:19:06

So after a little I remember piecing at the back of my head a fact I get a haircut and I went straight back in the trip thinking these guys who are trying to kill me so pissed at the the door and they must have sought our CCTV CCTV and they put me in this holding cell and then I remember like attacking an Arab dude in there because I thought everyone was against it. I thought everyone's trying to kill me man. But I was able to like point at like a whiteboard and go at that and go purple or whatever I was. I was able to move and shift everything. It was just crazy, crazy trip. And so all I wanted to do was go back to my mum and she lives in Toowoomba. So I drove from Brisbane to see Mum and it took me two days and we were working in a small country town called Gatton. So I stopped. I stopped there and went and apologized to everyone. I went on like a salsa Like when apologize to my team, and like went on this like, just clean up my shit and like apologizing to the way I spoke to them and like my undercurrents of like judging them and like, like me putting, like all the judgments I had about them in my head when I cleaned all that up, got to mom's place, Mom was freaking the fuck out. And I remember the last thing I said to my mom is like, Mom, I'm gonna go to sleep right now. And what I'm going to do is blow myself into billions and trillions of pieces so I can experience myself. Now knowing what I know now is that's pretty much what consciousness is doing. So like I tapped into something, which was really amazing. So had a day off work went to work. And then I'm like, What the fuck was that? And the only people that ever knew that meditated was I studied Buddhism at school in grade 11. And I knew that month meditated. It's like fuck I want to read, I want to find what that thing was like that, that that real, that reality I saw was so real. What was that? So I studied Buddhism for three years. And so I literally, for months, this I'd finished work, I'd go home and just read Damn, I've got so many books and books here, and just read and read and study and just like meditate, and that's what started that journey. And through that self discovery of like, what is this? I met this, this amazing gentleman, his name was Richard Manzi. He was he was working for me, he was a machine operator. And he said, man, you're not like all these other men. You're reading every single night when you get back, you're not on the booze. You got this thing about you? What are you chasing? Then? Like, there's this thing called enlightenment. And I've heard that Buddha's teaching, I think that I've experienced, I've been like it. And I think I want to become a Buddhist. And he said to me, do you know that you don't have to reach enlightenment if you don't have to just be a Buddhist? And then he goes, I've got a book for you. And it gave me the power of now, Eckhart Tolle is power of now. And so him and I formed this amazing bond. And so I had this one personal life that fucking got me I didn't have that Buddhism thing I hid from everyone. I was going to a temple every Sunday, no one knew it was just me. I didn't tell anyone because I was still around all these dudes dealing cocaine and cheating on their wives, all this stuff. So I was like living with complete polis life, complete polar. So him and I really connected deeply. And that's when I started like personal. That's when I started. I actually went to Eckhart Tolle retreat. When I started sabbatical, went to South America, sober. First time, I never cheated on a partner. And so I was with my ex, then. And so I really stepped into myself, came back to Sunshine Coast, donated a lot of time to Chenrezig, the Buddhist institute here, and it's my first like, real big service work. So I saw the nuns had like, dirt ramps that they had stairs, and they had walking frames and everything. So pulled together exhausted when construction, this massive big like, all meals, wagon is concrete, like big people, and we've concreted all the piles up. They're all donated. And so it was like the first thing that I found my purpose of like donating my time. And we have just been a service. Actually what? Always add two weeks, my wife and I've been together seven years since on the 24th of January. And she was we've been dating two months, and my Hey, can you come out with me to Chenrezig on bed to take the vows to become a Buddhist? And that's when we met. And so yeah, she came out the first day, had this question and asked this question that no one gave an answer that were for about an hour or half. I'm like, Yep, cool. This, this, I can't vow to become a Buddhist, because integrity is super important to me. I'd be my word. And I would have broken that vow so many fucking times with lying and alcohol and not any meat. So decided not to become Buddhist, but I love a lot of that philosophy. Hence, breath is the eldest boy's name and yeah, so yeah, that was that was that. And so the big shift of wireless construction is what to do with MICC Mates in Construction came back into the construction industry, hey, we're going to redo that suicide Lopez training. When I redid it, I broke down in this in the workshop. So I actually grieved, the friends that suicide attempt to fire up all these men. And I had this really beautiful opportunity that our company, a subcontractor fucked up a big Bunnings job and so had to go to Bunnings and babysit them to SikaFlex over three kilometers of cracks up in this slab at a bonus. I was there for like three months, man, just let those sit in the car, paid our full salary for eight hours. But what we're not gonna do at this time, so read Neale Donald Walsch book conversation As we got read that, then I start to ask myself big questions. Who am I? And why am I here? And then I came to those big realizations, the construction is not for me.

Ian Hawkins: 1:25:12

Love it. Isn't it amazing when when we have a desire to change that the circumstances show up that allow us to, because people often get caught in this. But how am I going to do that? Well just manifest a job where you get to sit in the car for eight hours a day and still get paid, right?

: 1:25:27

For salary or startup, like trying to learn guitar, or play video games for a bit. I actually this is I think there's a reason I'm here. So no, someone told me to read conversations off guard at Matt, as conversation got still got the price tag, and it was $7. It was from a used bookstore and Richard Manzi, that do, we were down at Goga, or some place that his family had this holiday home on the coast, and he's like, bro, you should go to this. There's an op shop book, they got all these spiritual books in there, man go in and choose one. And that's the book that I chose. However, in the next day, I read that and there's always questions and had these epiphanies of like, Ah, I'm not actually my body. There's something greater within me, that isn't like

Ian Hawkins: 1:26:17

mind blowing mates, it was you, thank you for sharing all of that. Love it. Obviously, it's my my crazy stories, like the stuff that I went through in Bali, around divisions and so on. So most of the audience won't be unfamiliar with those. And the other thing I want to I really want to touch on and it's funny, I'm getting shown at the end, like, like, sort of significant, when you're told, as a seven year old, you're now the dad. For from, from my own personal experience, and from from so many people I talk to the the learning is, I'm now responsible for everyone else. And it becomes such a hardwired response. And when we see it, again, we come back to the parents thing is that the feeling of being responsible to keep everyone else happy to keep everyone else, whatever. Some of the things you talked about, particularly in that early stages was very much a link to that responsibility. I need to be there for these people. Like, how hardwired was that? And what how have you been able to, to create that change? Where, where what you're describing now is being able to be self responsible? And how that's changed your life?

: 1:27:36

Yeah, man, the the first thing is, I couldn't do it on my own. Like, I'd needed help and support with I'm wiring at all, it was just so heavily ingrained, especially being the eldest of five, as well, and just like breaking through that belief. And the other I think, for me, too, is it's the the way that I was getting validated. The way I was I was getting a sense of love and worth was fruit through doing but they're doing for him a very dominant way, very masculine way. And so like on the footy field, direct, hard, fast action straight away react, respond, like react without even thinking, how fast can you react job site was exactly the same, to the bigger wiring for me, even. And that happened as a kid too. So I was like, all fuck, I've just got to take action, like she's gonna pay Shut up just to show that the cable company brothers sisters, the biggest morning for me has been now being married, having three children is to soften. And to not be that masculine direct, forceful my way or highway. But man, because that's, that's not what I want to be. That's not what's required to raising the family. And it's not who I desire to be. So that is my work. And it's my cost at work because it's captured in so many different areas. I think that I have toured up in this area and this area will come back in and sneak its way in. So one of the things that I do a lot is break my state. So after our work and make sure that I go take a proper time, so 15 minutes for myself, and ground myself go at the nature look at the sunset been nature I did. So I've actually done something for me. So that then I come back in. And I'm like more loving than that warrior beast mode, do that work working. So that's a huge, huge thing. Even my partner, she'll go ground. I'll be the kids and it'll be going nuts, but she just knows I'm not handling it. Go get out. You're You're useless to me. Is this going to be worse if you've not come and vaccinated? So, yeah, that's been that unmooring the as a business owner, that it's really fun. I dance of that Savior coming up that hero like being caught in that Drama Triangle of like wanting to save everyone, and especially someone like coaches that are still in a job, that isn't their purpose as like, I've got to be the man to provide that for them. Like, that's the thinking that Big Brother or that fatherhood figure. But as a business perspective, that's not the best move right now. Because like it's going to be bigger expect like it's an aspiration, but doesn't need to happen straightaway. So as a business owner has been super challenging, it's I really see that really been really highlighted. And some negative things that were or some ineffective things would be even back when I was a foreman, I would burn out so much because I'd give the shirt off my back off of my time and my energy, my space to fucking everyone other than myself, like to save your wood. So that was the big things about choose myself, making sure I serve regularly making sure I have support seek counsel and other people go to other people's workshops and retreats be held like leaders need to be held to do the work and correct space like this camping holiday. Since I've been in business with myself we went away two weeks ago, went away for seven days and did no coaching calls. No social media, I didn't reply to anyone's the first time I've ever done that for seven days straight. In five years. It was amazing. It was it was worth it come back to a shit show. We like but it was like I needed that. So the family

Ian Hawkins: 1:31:39

so good. It comes kind of brings us full circle in something we're talking about at the start is being able to prioritize self and make time for self and renewing, through self not through the external validation or by or by service. They're important parts, but not like not the thing that's going to drive everything. So I love that. That's where you've that's how you've answered that really powerful. I love the interaction from your daughter then when you were talking about that stuff to around. Debt. It's like she was here.

: 1:32:15

Yeah. Yeah, it's interesting. Like she's allowed us to the three main like she's just found her little voice, man and make sure she's heard it to Big Brother. So awesome. Yeah, it should

Ian Hawkins: 1:32:27

be strong. I'll let you get back to your family Blaze. This was awesome. Really enjoyed it. Thank you so much, brother.

: 1:32:35

Mike. Thanks him for the space to chat open up is. Yeah, it was it was raw too. There's a couple of things that I spoke about for a while which is it's beautiful that space mates enjoy the conversation.

Ian Hawkins: 1:32:47

But to hear

I hope you enjoyed this episode of The Grief Code podcast. Thank you so much for listening. Please share it with a friend or family member that you know would benefit from hearing it too. If you are truly ready to heal your unresolved or unknown grief. Let's chat. Email me at info at Ian Hawkins coaching.com You can also stay connected with me by joining the Grief Code community at Ian Hawkins coaching.com forward slash The Grief Code and remember, so that I can help even more people to heal. Please subscribe and leave a review on your favorite podcast platform